double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

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double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

gour
Hello,

I wonder how to solve usage of double quotes sentences for continued paragraphs, iow. I have need for something like this:

== Test heading

This is a quote:
____
"`This is foo sentence.

And here is the bar one.`'' 
____

Some more text here.

Now I wonder whether it's possible to have the above two sentences within a quote enclosed with the double-quotes with AsciiDoc(tor) markup?

I want to use AsciiDoc(tor) markup with static-site-genarators - testing with Golang-based Hugo as well as with Python-based Nikola - and it's strange to see that the above example works with both Markdown and reStructuredText, practically out of the box:

rst

Test heading
============

This is a quote:

    "This is foo sentence.

    And here is the bar one."

Some more text here.

markdown

# Test heading #

This is a quote:

> "This is foo sentence.
>
> And here is the bar one."

Some more text here.
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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

LightGuardjp
Administrator
Use either the blockquote syntax or the air quote syntax, which can be found at http://asciidoctor.org/docs/asciidoc-syntax-quick-reference/#more-delimited-blocks

On Saturday, May 16, 2015, gour [via Asciidoctor :: Discussion] <[hidden email]> wrote:
Hello,

I wonder how to solve usage of double quotes sentences for continued paragraphs, iow. I have need for something like this:

== Test heading

This is a quote:
____
"`This is foo sentence.

And here is the bar one.`'' 
____

Some more text here.

Now I wonder whether it's possible to have the above two sentences within a quote enclosed with the double-quotes with AsciiDoc(tor) markup?

I want to use AsciiDoc(tor) markup with static-site-genarators - testing with Golang-based Hugo as well as with Python-based Nikola - and it's strange to see that the above example works with both Markdown and reStructuredText, practically out of the box:

rst

Test heading
============

This is a quote:

    "This is foo sentence.

    And here is the bar one."

Some more text here.

markdown

# Test heading #

This is a quote:

> "This is foo sentence.
>
> And here is the bar one."

Some more text here.



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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

mojavelinux
Administrator
In reply to this post by gour

On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 5:18 AM, gour [via Asciidoctor :: Discussion] <[hidden email]> wrote:
Now I wonder whether it's possible to have the above two sentences within a quote enclosed with the double-quotes with AsciiDoc(tor) markup?

I'm confused what the problem is. The blockquote syntax should already give you quotes.

This is a quote:

____
This is foo sentence.

And here is the bar one.
____

Some more text here.

Which appears as:



If you want the quote mark to be displayed differently, then that's a CSS issue. You could also customize the quote template.

If you'd rather insider the quote mark manually, then just type the smart quotes directly. AsciiDoc does not match smart quotes across paragraphs.

This is a quote:

____
“This is foo sentence.

And here is the bar one.”
____

Some more text here.
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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

mojavelinux
Administrator
In reply to this post by gour
Note that I did something similar for the EPUB3 backend where I use both a leading and a trailing quote in CSS.


-Dan

On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 4:08 PM, Dan Allen <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 5:18 AM, gour [via Asciidoctor :: Discussion] <[hidden email]> wrote:
Now I wonder whether it's possible to have the above two sentences within a quote enclosed with the double-quotes with AsciiDoc(tor) markup?

I'm confused what the problem is. The blockquote syntax should already give you quotes.

This is a quote:

____
This is foo sentence.

And here is the bar one.
____

Some more text here.

Which appears as:



If you want the quote mark to be displayed differently, then that's a CSS issue. You could also customize the quote template.

If you'd rather insider the quote mark manually, then just type the smart quotes directly. AsciiDoc does not match smart quotes across paragraphs.

This is a quote:

____
“This is foo sentence.

And here is the bar one.”
____

Some more text here.



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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

mojavelinux
Administrator
In reply to this post by gour

On Sat, May 16, 2015 at 4:08 PM, Dan Allen <[hidden email]> wrote:
I'm confused what the problem is.

Actually, I now understand what you are asking. Responses still the same.

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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

gour
In reply to this post by mojavelinux

mojavelinux [via Asciidoctor :: Discussion] <[hidden email]> writes:

> AsciiDoc does not match smart quotes across paragraphs.

That's the key. I thought there is (maybe) some escaping mechanism to do it,
but seeing there is none, I'll try to use something from the menu offered by
AsciiDoc(tor). However, I still have to check for some other things to
finally decide between AsciiDoc(tor) and reST, but that's for another topic.


Sincerely,
Gour
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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

mojavelinux
Administrator

On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 1:26 AM, gour [via Asciidoctor :: Discussion] <[hidden email]> wrote:
I thought there is (maybe) some escaping mechanism to do it

There is one way, but it's kind of a hack. You can force the paragraph to continue on and use hardbreaks instead actual paragraph boundaries.

[%hardbreaks]
____
"`First phrase.
{empty}
Second phrase.`"
____

However, I still stand by my opinion that Markdown and reStructuredText are not honoring the proper semantics for this scenario. Styling quotes, which is what these are, should not be put into the source document. They should be handled either by the converter or the styling mechanism (CSS). The delimited block boundaries are already providing the necessary semantics.

If it helps you think about it better, you can use the Asciidoctor-style quote block.

""
First phrase.

Second phrase.
""

:)

Cheers,

-Dan
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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

mojavelinux
Administrator
In reply to this post by gour

On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 1:26 AM, gour [via Asciidoctor :: Discussion] <[hidden email]> wrote:
I still have to check for some other things to
finally decide between AsciiDoc(tor) and reST, but that's for another topic.

If you have additional concerns or questions, know that you are always welcome to ask here. We're always eager to find new ways to simplify and improve AsciiDoc and the Asciidoctor toolchain.

Cheers,

-Dan
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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

mojavelinux
Administrator
In reply to this post by gour
Btw, here's how a block quote renders in Asciidoctor EPUB3 (proving that it's a CSS issue).




-Dan

On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 1:38 AM, Dan Allen <[hidden email]> wrote:

On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 1:26 AM, gour [via Asciidoctor :: Discussion] <[hidden email]> wrote:
I still have to check for some other things to
finally decide between AsciiDoc(tor) and reST, but that's for another topic.

If you have additional concerns or questions, know that you are always welcome to ask here. We're always eager to find new ways to simplify and improve AsciiDoc and the Asciidoctor toolchain.

Cheers,

-Dan



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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

gour
In reply to this post by mojavelinux

mojavelinux [via Asciidoctor :: Discussion] <[hidden email]> writes:

> There is one way, but it's kind of a hack. You can force the paragraph to
> continue on and use hardbreaks instead actual paragraph boundaries.

Ohh, that sounds interesting...

>
> [%hardbreaks]
> ____
> "`First phrase.
> {empty}
> Second phrase.`"
> ____

Now it's interested to note there are differences how the above snippet are
rendered by AsciiDoctor itself and Nikola & Hugo static-site-generators:

i) all three render the snippet as intended (by me):

“First phrase. Second phrase.”

but, somehow, {empty} attribute does not separate paragraphs.

> However, I still stand by my opinion that Markdown and reStructuredText are
> not honoring the proper semantics for this scenario. Styling quotes, which
> is what these are, should not be put into the source document. They should
> be handled either by the converter or the styling mechanism (CSS). The
> delimited block boundaries are already providing the necessary semantics.

Here I agree with you that styling should not be 'hardcoded' in the document.

> If it helps you think about it better, you can use the Asciidoctor-style
> quote block.
>
> ""
> First phrase.
>
> Second phrase.
> ""

This one is interesting:

It provides separated paragraphs, but no quotes within, iow.

First phrase.

Second phrase.


In any case, I believe I can live with it. ;)


Sincerely,
Gour

--
As the ignorant perform their duties with attachment to results,
the learned may similarly act, but without attachment, for the
sake of leading people on the right path.

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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

gour
In reply to this post by mojavelinux

mojavelinux [via Asciidoctor :: Discussion] <[hidden email]> writes:

> If you have additional concerns or questions, know that you are always
> welcome to ask here. We're always eager to find new ways to simplify and
> improve AsciiDoc and the Asciidoctor toolchain.

I must admit that it was much easier than expected...I have a need to use
symbols of planets and astrological signs in my writing and in the past I was
using Lyx/LaTeX with marvo symbol font where I was able to simply us
something like \Sun to get symbol for the sun or \Aries etc. for zodiacal
signs.

However, quickly I found out that it's super easy with AsciiDoctor, I defined
things like:

:aries:  ♈
...
:Sun: ☉
...

and then it's piece of cake to just use {Sun}, {Aries} etc. (of course,
assuming there is Unicode-aware font available.

Considering how easy & clean it is, I believe there are no more obstacles to
fully embrace AsciiDoctor for *all* my writings. :-)


Sincerely,
Gour
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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

gour
In reply to this post by mojavelinux

mojavelinux [via Asciidoctor :: Discussion] <[hidden email]> writes:

> Btw, here's how a block quote renders in Asciidoctor EPUB3 (proving that
> it's a CSS issue).

Thank you. It really proves it's styling issue...btw, happy to see epub3
capabilities in Asciidoctor toolchain since it's one of my desired targets
besides html/pdf. :-)


Sincerely,
Gour
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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

mojavelinux
Administrator
In reply to this post by gour
On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 4:06 AM, gour [via Asciidoctor :: Discussion] <[hidden email]> wrote:

> [%hardbreaks]
> ____
> "`First phrase.
> {empty}
> Second phrase.`"
> ____

Now it's interested to note there are differences how the above snippet are
rendered by AsciiDoctor itself and Nikola & Hugo static-site-generators:

i) all three render the snippet as intended (by me):

“First phrase. Second phrase.”

but, somehow, {empty} attribute does not separate paragraphs.

Oops, I put the %hardbreaks in the wrong place. That should be:

____
[%hardbreaks]
"`First phrase.
{empty}
Second phrase.`"
____

Keep in mind that won't work with AsciiDoc Python. Also, it's still a huge hack :)
 
> If it helps you think about it better, you can use the Asciidoctor-style
> quote block.
>
> ""
> First phrase.
>
> Second phrase.
> ""

This one is interesting:

It provides separated paragraphs, but no quotes within, iow.

I didn't mean to suggest that this syntax would add quotes. Just that it helps you think about the fact that the block quote is already quoted...so a template or the CSS can understand where to place them, if that's the styling you prefer.

Cheers,

-Dan


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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

mojavelinux
Administrator
In reply to this post by gour

On Sun, May 17, 2015 at 4:12 AM, gour [via Asciidoctor :: Discussion] <[hidden email]> wrote:
Considering how easy & clean it is, I believe there are no more obstacles to
fully embrace AsciiDoctor for *all* my writings. :-)

\o/

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Re: double quotes & multi-line paragraphs

gour
This post was updated on .
In reply to this post by mojavelinux
mojavelinux wrote
Oops, I put the %hardbreaks in the wrong place. That should be:

____
[%hardbreaks]
"`First phrase.
{empty}
Second phrase.`"
____
Ohh, that's much better.

Keep in mind that won't work with AsciiDoc Python.
I don't have much legacy to be bothered with it.

Also, it's still a huge hack :)
Well, I'll probably try to use something else in the long run, but it is still nice to see that AsciiDoctor can do it.